it struck me that witnesses have mastered the art of revelling in "trials and problems" that require "enduring".
of course, the persecution complex, and the paranoia about these "wicked last days" no doubt contributes to this.. if one witness has some health issue, or if another has a family drama, they seem to revel in sharing these stories amongst their witness friends...almost in an attempt to elicit sympathy.. has anyone else noticed this?.
most normal people though outside of the org, simply recognise that life has its ups and downs, and need to be dealt with..
"Heartaches are heroes when their pockets are full"
A line from the song "Seven Year Ache" which to me describes what you are talking about.
People who are doing well and don't really have anything to complain about, often like to brag about how hard they have, or have had things in life. It makes them feel less guilty for not currently being part of the Judeo Christian martyrdom that is so looked up to by a certain cross section of our society.
another hollywood memory____________________“thanks for the pink chablis, marta.
who’s that singing?
sounds familiar.”.
I have uncovered no details about her death--I'd love to get a link from you.
Thank you!
The arizona republic has quite a few articles that include her mostly about her art but you have to join their site. https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/20080255/
Here's her high school year book but you have to join to see her photo http://www.e-yearbook.com/sp/eybb?school=26044&year=1969
Father: George B Boutel AZ
Mother: Carolyn Smith Sydney Australia
Richard John Karsten 65 AZ( 2nd Husband?)
Jeff G Boutel Seattle (Brother?) https://businessprofiles.com/details/jeff-boutel-properties-inc/US-WA-601800180/marta-boutel
She was also known as "Martha" Boutel Irvin and was married to a Kevin Irvine
another hollywood memory____________________“thanks for the pink chablis, marta.
who’s that singing?
sounds familiar.”.
Marta died rather young in her fourties....did you ever find out why? I'm seeing things that make it sound as if foul play was involved
Is this her photo and artwork?
world population growth rate is 1.13%, whilst jehovah's witness average publishers grew by 1.8%.
watchtower growth is outpacing population growth, though at a dismal rate considering the 2 billion hours of preaching required for an increase of just 115,194. this is an aggregate number, and most growth is from developing nations in africa and south america.
what i was really interested in finding is how watchtower growth compares to the population growth in different countries.
The number of hours per recruit really does highlight how incredibly ineffective the publishing work is ... but it doesn't cost them (the org) anything (vs buying a super-bowl ad).
I don't think the quick ingathering of individuals before the end comes is a true concern to them. They must realize that if they were to purchase advertising on national television, they'd be overwhelmed with responses, overnight and the "Good news would be preached throughout the earth" and the long awaited end would come.
The problem is, the eyes of the public would be upon them. They'd be in the spotlight and would be accountable for everything they say and do and have said and done. There would be public scrutiny. The way things are now, they fly under the radar of the general public. Most people think their experience with JW's is an isolated incident unique unto themselves or their particular local. They don't realize the scope of what is going on. It's easy for them to dismiss them as just another fanatical religious group.
I think for the leaders at Bethel and for many JW's being a Jehovah's Witness is a way of life rather than a means to and end.
there is usually a metamorphosis that takes place for a person to leave the jehovah's witness religion.
most people do not just up and go simply because they realize this could not be the truth.
it often takes time.. for those that go to meetings or engage in the ministry, will you forever continue doing these things, knowing that it is all bs?
For those that go to meetings or engage in the ministry, will you forever continue doing these things, knowing that it is all BS? Is there a point where you will ever simply leave the organization?
Many are victims of their own hope, so they hang on, hoping that somehow things will change.
Musn't forget Olivia
in the last week i have had three visits from brothers.
so 6 witnesses in all as they come in pairs.
now considering i used to go to the meetings, sit by myself and literally no one talked to me - ever - why the concern all of a sudden?.
To be fair some of them have been extremely sweet and kind, particularly one brother who is the most christian person I've ever met. He's just moved back into my congregation and he wanted to just call and say hello and he really is a lovely, kind person.
When a Buddhist who lives in China is sweet and kind and a Muslim from Turkey treats his wife and children well, is he said to be acting "Christian"? It's funny how Christians and JW's in particular, on a certain level of consciousness, believe being good and kind is limited to Christians and is proof that they are the true religion.
I can't tell you how many times I left that place in tears at the coldness shown me. So why the sudden bombardment??
Jehovah's Witnesses are not a live and let live religion where people are encouraged to have a relationship with God in their own individual way. A lot of them want to see you doing what they are doing because it validates them. My guess is that this is because they are one misplaced thought away from straying themselves and it makes them nervous to see something or someone out of place. People who can barely control themselves figure everyone else is the same way and they project their insecurities onto others and try to control them in an effort to make themselves feel safer. It probably makes them feel abandoned when they see people leaving and it makes them question themselves. It's easier to jump in and try to undo the change they see in someone else, rather than look inward, which can be scary if you haven't done it in awhile (or ever).
IMHO, their visits are mostly about them, rather than out of concern for you.
a brother used this illustration throughout his talk recently.
of course, it was meant to cause guilt in people like me or anybody else who might be prone to feeling guilty anyhow.
i approached him afterwards and said that he was speaking disparagingly of god's arrangement.
You : I think of myself more as a bump on a pickle, which is similar to a bump on a log... only it tastes better.
That "brother's" comment reminds me of the false analogies that were often used on the platform to compare two dissimilar things in order to make one of those things look bad.
They'd often compare religion to science, for example, when really one is a method of knowledge and the other is a system of belief and unlike science, is not known for revising itself once new and contrary evidence is discovered unless they blame imperfect human interpretation. Somehow, they'd compare the two in such a way that if you weren't paying particular attention, you might find yourself going along with their train of thought.
since leaving the jws i have become fascinated by the lds church, because of the similarities both organisations have.
in reading x-mo forums i get the impression that they tend to be not as bitter and as twisted as xjw.
this is surprising as i think the lds is a bigger con than the jws.
It seems to me Mormons are able to live a day to day life that doesn't shut out and condemn the rest of the world in terms of Education, School Activities, Sports, Careers etc. Perhaps Mormons who leave the church have an easier time assimilating into normal society because they've got their bases covered in terms of work and education and how to mingle with others.
We former JW's have never even so much as celebrated a birthday or been part of anything that didn't revolve around the meetings. When we leave, we loose not only our friends and family but we are recovering from the loss of a false hope of everlasting life.
Dame Edna
